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05-10-2008, 5:11 PM Pablo49 Joined on 08-24-2005 In your Band....Stealin' your Dinkles Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die?  tom18230 wrote: You believe God created the Earth and all of pablo's squirrels in 7 days, you LITERALLY believe that... yet you take another part of the bible - communion, as just a symbol? How do you differentiate what to take as symbolism and what to take literally? It seems to me as if you just decide "Nah, I don't really believe that, it's just symbolism" and "Thats cool, I think I'll take that literally." Why do you think some parts are just symbolism, but others aren't? Coming form someone who doesn't read the bible, eh? no, The bible says that god created the word,...7days, etc... And it comes staight out and says it. But form communion does it say straight out: Eat this bread a preist will bless it and it will become my flesh, and this wine will eb blessed and it will actually become my blood. Then drink/ eat of it, and you will be saved? no, didn't think so. And yes, some parts you take litteraly and some you don't. When your in English class they tell you about symbolism and hidden messages in the text. The ones nobody in class never understands because no one cares? Well, those same kinds of symbolism are int he bible. we have to fiqure out alot of this on our own. They evolve to survive. If they cannot evolve quick enough, they die. The changes Earth goes through, are very slow, and allow enough time for species to evolve, just slightly to survive whatever the changes are that happens. Take the ice age for example, do you think all those millions of species just died out? No, they evolved to survive. It's not like they go "brrr, it's chilly out here, lets evolve." I don't know all the exact scientific facts, but my understanding of it is their cells, tissue, DNA etc all notice the slight change in temperature. As thousands of years pass, their DNA mutates with each generation of offspring to adapt to the changes. they evolve because they are the only one left ho can live. back to my squirrels... The ones tat didn't have the mutation that let them live through the cold died, the others where the only ones whocould live. So they became the new specis. Apply that to the ice age as well..and ther is your answer to that. The Your mistaken about the cells, tissues DNA noticing the cold, or whatever. First DNA is just a chemical, cna't do anything on it's own anyway. And, the cells and tissues, etc... can't decided to start to change to survive the cold. There was some gene  or mutation that the squirrel has that lets them live. A random happenstance. DNA mutates through the generations naturaly, your DNA is not an exact copy of your parents combined DNA, you have some genes that are a tiny bit different that neithe of your parent's have. It just happens. Other times, a mutation randomly occurs, creating different species (of course this takes thousands and thousands of years). That's my understand of it. True, the mutations can randomly happen that let say...lets the squirls coolect nuts faster and get some of the harder to get nuts easier. So we have some normal squrrels and some that are mutated. he ones that are mutated take almost allt he nuts since they are so good at it. The others have trouble finding nuts because they are almost all gone, they slowly start to starve and less and lessof them are born through the generations as more and more are born from the mutants. Then only the mutants survive, creating  new specis of squirrel (pablo's super squirrels, =p) That how they would naturaly go through speciation without an outside force. Well, I can't prove that to you pablo. I have a basic understanding of this (just barely ), I have studied up on this, so I know what its about so I don't make blind opinions, and I like to watch the discovery channel, so I hear it alot. =] so I can't give any real scientific evidence about this. I accept your apology. =p jk  tom18230 wrote: WOOT WOOT WOOT WOOT WOOOOOO! DING DING DING! This is the ceremonial 1,000,000th time pablo has started a post with "^ second." Award for most agreeing member goes to......*drum roll*...PABLO49! haha    Report     05-10-2008, 5:29 PM tom18230 Joined on 01-21-2006 Scotland Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die? Coming form someone who doesn't read the bible, eh? Where did I say that? I've been to catholic schools since I was 5. Went to catholic, protestant and christian masses, spoke to many different priests, bishops etc. I think I am a very well informed Atheist. I have read the bible, so don't make assumptions pablo. no, The bible says that god created the word,...7days, etc... And it comes staight out and says it. But form communion does it say straight out: Eat this bread a preist will bless it and it will become my flesh, and this wine will eb blessed and it will actually become my blood. Then drink/ eat of it, and you will be saved? no, didn't think so. And yes, some parts you take litteraly and some you don't. When your in English class they tell you about symbolism and hidden messages in the text. The ones nobody in class never understands because no one cares? Well, those same kinds of symbolism are int he bible. we have to fiqure out alot of this on our own. Your splitting hairs now. This is an exact quote from the bible I have sitting in front of me (yes, atheists have bibles ) "While they were eating, Jesus took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to his disciple saying “Take and eat, this is my body.”" Jesus says "This is my body." He is saying that communion is his body. He passes the bread, and tells his disciples it is body. How does that differ from Genesis? I don't get how you can possibly accept some pits as symbolism, but some literally. Hidden messages in the bible? I think through the hundreds of years of translations, any hidden messages are long, long lost. they evolve because they are the only one left ho can live. back to my squirrels... The ones tat didn't have the mutation that let them live through the cold died, the others where the only ones whocould live. So they became the new specis. Apply that to the ice age as well..and ther is your answer to that. Are you not basically backing me up here? You're saying the squirrels evolve because they have to, which is what I said ? The Your mistaken about the cells, tissues DNA noticing the cold, or whatever. First DNA is just a chemical, cna't do anything on it's own anyway. And, the cells and tissues, etc... can't decided to start to change to survive the cold. There was some gene  or mutation that the squirrel has that lets them live. A random happenstance. DNA mutates through the generations naturaly, your DNA is not an exact copy of your parents combined DNA, you have some genes that are a tiny bit different that neithe of your parent's have. It just happens. Exactly, are you agreeing or disagreeing with me, because that's what I'm trying to say - species evolve and adapt to survive, sometimes by mistake True, the mutations can randomly happen that let say...lets the squirls coolect nuts faster and get some of the harder to get nuts easier. So we have some normal squrrels and some that are mutated. he ones that are mutated take almost allt he nuts since they are so good at it. The others have trouble finding nuts because they are almost all gone, they slowly start to starve and less and lessof them are born through the generations as more and more are born from the mutants. Then only the mutants survive, creating  new specis of squirrel (pablo's super squirrels, =p) That how they would naturaly go through speciation without an outside force. ...evolution without God, basically? I don't understand this then, you're just backing me up here. I have studied up on this, so I know what its about so I don't make blind opinions, and I like to watch the discovery channel, so I hear it alot. =] I accept your apology. =p jk Ok....again, are you actually arguing with me, or just agreeing with me about evolution lol ?    Report     05-10-2008, 6:04 PM Pablo49 Joined on 08-24-2005 In your Band....Stealin' your Dinkles Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die?  tom18230 wrote: Where did I say that? I've been to catholic schools since I was 5. Went to catholic, protestant and christian masses, spoke to many different priests, bishops etc. I think I am a very well informed Atheist. I have read the bible, so don't make assumptions pablo. okay, my bad. sorry =] Your splitting hairs now. This is an exact quote from the bible I have sitting in front of me (yes, atheists have bibles ) "While they were eating, Jesus took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to his disciple saying “Take and eat, this is my body.”" Jesus says "This is my body." He is saying that communion is his body. He passes the bread, and tells his disciples it is body. How does that differ from Genesis? I don't get how you can possibly accept some pits as symbolism, but some literally. Hidden messages in the bible? I think through the hundreds of years of translations, any hidden messages are long, long lost. Well, according to the ACC, that is how it is thought of. And you can't take the genisis thing simbolicly. Well, does it say that this will save you? Does it say that doing this does what the Catholics think it does? He may say to eat it it as His flesh, but in mo way does He tell that it is of any purpose to your salvation? Are you not basically backing me up here? You're saying the squirrels evolve because they have to, which is what I said ? Party, This time I was argueing, I was just filling in the holes in what you know. I was helping you understand it. I was being good. =] Exactly, are you agreeing or disagreeing with me, because that's what I'm trying to say - species evolve and adapt to survive, sometimes by mistake yet again, fixing a few holes in what you thought, I WAS BEING NICE!! ...evolution without God, basically? I don't understand this then, you're just backing me up here. That's after the fact of creatation. Everyone knows about speciation. But Evolution goes all the way back and says that everything evolved from one basic creature. So saying humans came from some 1 celled critter int he seas. That I don't agree with...well, I would just sayy it out right isn't true. Ok....again, are you actually arguing with me, or just agreeing with me about evolution lol ? Ummm...partly. I was filling in the holes where you had things wrong but were on the right track. (that's what I get for being nice! ) Argueing with you on the others ^how do you spell that? doesn't look right...  tom18230 wrote: WOOT WOOT WOOT WOOT WOOOOOO! DING DING DING! This is the ceremonial 1,000,000th time pablo has started a post with "^ second." Award for most agreeing member goes to......*drum roll*...PABLO49! haha    Report     05-10-2008, 6:22 PM tom18230 Joined on 01-21-2006 Scotland Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die? okay, my bad. sorry =] It's ok pablo, you're super squirrels make up for it :P. Well, according to the ACC, that is how it is thought of. And you can't take the genisis thing simbolicly. Well, does it say that this will save you? Does it say that doing this does what the Catholics think it does? He may say to eat it it as His flesh, but in mo way does He tell that it is of any purpose to your salvation? Does that matter? I didn't think we were arguing (thats how it's spelled I think :P?) about the effect of it, just if it is to to be taken literally or not. Catholic's beleive it should be, protestants believe it shouldn't, as well as most christian religions. I take genesis symbolically. I do not believe the Earth was created in 7 days, I think it is a symbol to show how God created everything, and how Sunday should be the sabbath day to rest. Just like the story of Adam and Eve, the stories in the bible are just symbolisms to help you understand the faith - not to be taken literally. BUT, big BUT (I like big BUT's, and I cannot lie...etc etc).. if you decide to take these literally, why not all of them? If the bible says the Earth was created in 7 days, why can't you believe communion is the body of Jesus? I don't get how you can just decide to take some parts literally, other parts symbolically? That's after the fact of creatation. Everyone knows about speciation. But Evolution goes all the way back and says that everything evolved from one basic creature. So saying humans came from some 1 celled critter int he seas. That I don't agree with...well, I would just sayy it out right isn't true. Ok, this is the real argument here. Let me get it straight on what you believe - do you believe God created EVERYTHING, every single different animal, every species, every human being, and from then on, they evolved? Is that what you believe?    Report     05-10-2008, 6:32 PM unrealrocker Joined on 02-08-2006 colbert nation Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die? no one agreed with my theroy...tear -sig by bmw    Report     05-10-2008, 6:39 PM Pablo49 Joined on 08-24-2005 In your Band....Stealin' your Dinkles Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die?  tom18230 wrote: It's ok pablo, you're super squirrels make up for it :P. Yea they do! =] Does that matter? I didn't think we were arguing (thats how it's spelled I think :P?) about the effect of it, just if it is to to be taken literally or not. Catholic's beleive it should be, protestants believe it shouldn't, as well as most christian religions. I take genesis symbolically. I do not believe the Earth was created in 7 days, I think it is a symbol to show how God created everything, and how Sunday should be the sabbath day to rest. Just like the story of Adam and Eve, the stories in the bible are just symbolisms to help you understand the faith - not to be taken literally. BUT, big BUT (I like big BUT's, and I cannot lie...etc etc).. if you decide to take these literally, why not all of them? If the bible says the Earth was created in 7 days, why can't you believe communion is the body of Jesus? I don't get how you can just decide to take some parts literally, other parts symbolically? hmmm....well, I guess it is the body of christ. I'm wrong aboout the body of christ thing, okay. We did stray away from my original point about this. The point was more about how the Catholics add a meaning to it that there really isn't one for. It has nothing to do with saving you, and has no real reason to do it beside Jesus told his deciples to do it. How can we take some thing literally and some not? Well, (even though your not american you should still understand what I'm geting at here) The constitution has been argued over since it's creation, what does all of the differnt things mean. Some have to be taken literaly some are symbolic and taken different ways. Like the whole man was created equal thing. Well does that men all men?, because we had slaves for a long time, does that include wemon?, because we had porblems there too with rights and voting. If we took everything literally we would have a problem. I would have to kill you. no really I would have to stone you to death. (look it up, I'm not kidding) Ok, this is the real argument here. Let me get it straight on what you believe - do you believe God created EVERYTHING, every single different animal, every species, every human being, and from then on, they evolved? Is that what you believe? God created animals, humans, plants, etc... Since then nature has taken it's course too. Not too much has happened though, Not alot of time since He created animals and man. Arguing ^still doesn't look right... EDIT:nope I googled it, that's right, lol  tom18230 wrote: WOOT WOOT WOOT WOOT WOOOOOO! DING DING DING! This is the ceremonial 1,000,000th time pablo has started a post with "^ second." Award for most agreeing member goes to......*drum roll*...PABLO49! haha    Report     05-10-2008, 7:34 PM river Joined on 01-19-2006 A Warm Place Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die? Not alot of time since He created animals and man. StudioDRD  Doghog73 wrote: Suds has the same problum i do: we are intellegent but have difficulty using it.    Report     05-10-2008, 7:36 PM tom18230 Joined on 01-21-2006 Scotland Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die? Not alot of time since He created animals and man. I'll answer the rest tomorrow... but like river "said", do you not believe in dinosaurs, fossils etc? Are you going to tell us you don't believe in fossil fuels, which take millions and millions of years to form?    Report     05-10-2008, 7:36 PM Pablo49 Joined on 08-24-2005 In your Band....Stealin' your Dinkles Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die?  river wrote: Not alot of time since He created animals and man. ^epic That's a whole different argument...I don't even know... EDIT: sneaky tom is sneaky.... I do, but I've always been told in church the earth is only about 5 thousand years old... There is too much FACT behind that not being true. I tend to shy away from such arguments when around church and such due to conflicts of interests. Too bad I used to be a mega dinosaur freak... I'll enjoy this sweet argument tomorrow...after church. =p  tom18230 wrote: WOOT WOOT WOOT WOOT WOOOOOO! DING DING DING! This is the ceremonial 1,000,000th time pablo has started a post with "^ second." Award for most agreeing member goes to......*drum roll*...PABLO49! haha    Report     05-10-2008, 10:04 PM the savage Joined on 02-25-2006 For God, Comrade, and Profit Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die? http://bibleprobe.com/beetle.htm If I can I'll try to upload the video for you Tom... So I looked, and behold, a pale horse. And the name of him who sat on it was death, and Hades followed with him. And power was given to him over a fourth of the earth, to kill with sword, with hunger, with death, and by the beasts of the earth. Revolutions 6:8 NKJV    Report     05-10-2008, 10:05 PM the savage Joined on 02-25-2006 For God, Comrade, and Profit Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die?  tom18230 wrote: Not alot of time since He created animals and man. I'll answer the rest tomorrow... but like river "said", do you not believe in dinosaurs, fossils etc? Are you going to tell us you don't believe in fossil fuels, which take millions and millions of years to form? How do our brilliant Scientists know that Fossil Fuels take millions of years to form, just a humble question... So I looked, and behold, a pale horse. And the name of him who sat on it was death, and Hades followed with him. And power was given to him over a fourth of the earth, to kill with sword, with hunger, with death, and by the beasts of the earth. Revolutions 6:8 NKJV    Report     05-10-2008, 10:11 PM sk8erBoy Joined on 03-04-2008 Call me Sk8 Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die? Pablo wrote: //babtising is SHOWING your acceptance in God. It even says it in the bible. (I can't rememebr the verse, before you ask me for it) It's not needed to be saved. Like wearing a t-shirt with your ffavorite team on it. Ypu can be a fan of that team with or without that shirt. But that shirt shows that you are to others. see my point?// Woot woot go Pabsy. Everything I am about to say to Tom you have already said in the way I would have. Tom wrote: //I can believe in evolution, because there is proof to back it up.// Cmon! You can't actually believe there is proof that backs up evolution?!? It takes A LOT more to believe in big bang crap or whatever you believe in than it takes to believe in a book...The Bible...And if you believe in the Bible..Then you believe in God. Oh and Tom. There IS proof of God. It's called the Bible...Maybe they don't have any in Scotland but you should import one so you can read some REAL truth. Mario Kart Wii: 1332-8113-5939 Super Smash Bros Brawl: 3523-1726-0167    Report     05-10-2008, 10:13 PM the savage Joined on 02-25-2006 For God, Comrade, and Profit Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die?  sk8erBoy wrote: Pablo wrote: //babtising is SHOWING your acceptance in God. It even says it in the bible. (I can't rememebr the verse, before you ask me for it) It's not needed to be saved. Like wearing a t-shirt with your ffavorite team on it. Ypu can be a fan of that team with or without that shirt. But that shirt shows that you are to others. see my point?// Woot woot go Pabsy. Everything I am about to say to Tom you have already said in the way I would have. Tom wrote: //I can believe in evolution, because there is proof to back it up.// Cmon! You can't actually believe there is proof that backs up evolution?!? It takes A LOT more to believe in big bang crap or whatever you believe in than it takes to believe in a book...The Bible...And if you believe in the Bible..Then you believe in God. Oh and Tom. There IS proof of God. It's called the Bible...Maybe they don't have any in Scotland but you should import one so you can read some REAL truth. Facts carry much more weight than opinions, remember that when making an argument, just a little suggestion matey... So I looked, and behold, a pale horse. And the name of him who sat on it was death, and Hades followed with him. And power was given to him over a fourth of the earth, to kill with sword, with hunger, with death, and by the beasts of the earth. Revolutions 6:8 NKJV    Report     05-11-2008, 8:53 AM tom18230 Joined on 01-21-2006 Scotland Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die?  sk8erBoy wrote: Cmon! You can't actually believe there is proof that backs up evolution?!? It takes A LOT more to believe in big bang crap or whatever you believe in than it takes to believe in a book...The Bible...And if you believe in the Bible..Then you believe in God. Oh and Tom. There IS proof of God. Get the *** out this thread you stupid moron. You are the WORST kind of christian, the one who thinks they are completely right, and will actually spout out random"facts" to prove their point. The bible is "proof" God is real? So, going along with that...theres books on scientology, I guess that makes their God's real. There's books about UFO's and aliens, so they're real. It's called the Bible...Maybe they don't have any in Scotland but you should import one so you can read some REAL truth. Well, you do realise Scotland is actually a CHRISTIAN country. You can only be charged with blasphemy in Scotland if it's against Christianity. You can talk crap about muslims, jews, hindu's and no one gives a crap. But as soon as you say anything bad about Christianity, everyone's up in arms. So don't talk shit when you clearly know NOTHING about what you are saying. You're an idiotic moron. I could have actually respected you before that comment, but if you really think your precious bible is the "real" truth, then you need to open your eyes. Pablo, sav etc can actually listen to different theories about the world and disect them and think about them.... but you, you're just an idiot - you obviously know *** all about your own religion, you idiot.    Report     05-11-2008, 8:53 AM tom18230 Joined on 01-21-2006 Scotland Re: Poll: What do you think happens after you die?  the savage wrote:  tom18230 wrote: Not alot of time since He created animals and man. I'll answer the rest tomorrow... but like river "said", do you not believe in dinosaurs, fossils etc? Are you going to tell us you don't believe in fossil fuels, which take millions and millions of years to form? How do our brilliant Scientists know that Fossil Fuels take millions of years to form, just a humble question... Well, if they DIDN'T take millions of years to form, why are we now running out of fossil fuels? Think about it, you say the Earth is 5..6 thousand years old? How long do you propose fossil fuels take to form then? And think about mountains, lakes, rivers, the grand canyon. Do you believe they were all created when the Earth was created by God? Then why are mountains still growing slightly taller every year? Why are continents shifting small distances each year? But I already know the answer "prove it?"..lol.    Report

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